023 | State of the Game

Intro [0:23]

Morgan:  Pickleball is an unyielding juggernaut of momentum. From the grassroots to the pro-level, the game just keeps growing. As the CEO of Pickleball Central, Edward Hechter is in a prime position to address the state of the game and give us insight into the evolution of the modern paddle. 

Now, if you’ve never heard of Pickleball Central, then either you’ve been dinking in a cave for the last 15 years, or you’ve accidentally found this podcast while trying to listen to the other Morgan Evans – he’s a country music artist. I guess he’s kind of famous; I don’t know. If it’s the latter, then you will be a little confused by this podcast, but you’ll probably enjoy it more than listening to the countless acts for 45 minutes. Just jokes, other Morgan. But answer your emails, mate. Come on, we’d be hilarious on the court, and we’re from the same country.

Anyway, I digress. Please welcome, Mr. Edward Hechter.

What Is Pickleball Central? [1:14]

Morgan:  Edward, how are you, mate?

Edward: I’m doing well. How are you doing?

Morgan:  Very well! Very well! Thank you so much for taking the time to be on the show. 

Edward:  It is absolutely my pleasure! I love what you do for Pickleball, and I think this is such an amazing thing that you’ve put your time into for this podcast. I’m humbled to be here. 

Morgan:  Well, it’s very sweet of you, but we should wait until the end of it before it’s been my pleasure for sure.  You never know what I’m going to ask, right? Jeez!

Edward:  (laughs…) I’m trying to recall the last time you and I were on the court together. I think you tagged me seven times in four minutes, so I should probably keep the pattern going.

Morgan:  Good idea!

So for our 3.4 million listeners, there might be someone out there who doesn’t know what Pickleball Central is. So can you give us a brief history of the company and how you got started in it?

Edward:  Absolutely! Pickleball Central is the largest company exclusively devoted in Pickleball in the world, and that is a big thing today. But back when we started, Pickleball was much smaller. We got founded 14 years ago by David Johnson and Anna Copley, the co-founders of the company. It was literally a kitchen table business. This is a business that you start with nothing more than a laptop and a little extra space at home. And the company was founded after Anna tried to find gifts to purchase for her mom, who had become a Pickleball player and couldn’t find anything online that she liked. So she decided that it was time to build a niche, some gift products in the Pickleball space. She started Pickleball Central with David to provide T-shirts and apparel options to Pickleball players. That was 2006, and here we are in 2020 and we’re a little different company today.

Morgan:  (chuckles…) Yes, it’s basically a global enterprise now.

Edward:  It is, yeah. We have customers all over the world. I think we’ve shipped products to like 34 different countries or maybe 48 – I forgot the number. I have to check with Johnny on that. But it’s been really an exciting journey to watch the company evolve as the game has evolved and as the sport has evolved, and has the industry has evolved.

Morgan:  Yeah, and obviously, the sport is growing like wildfire. And one of the reasons why I really wanted to get you on the show is to celebrate your recent awards. It was two leading publications that had recognized your work. Firstly, the Puget Sound Business Journal listed you number 52 out of the top 100 fastest-growing companies in Washington. Secondly, the Racquet Sports Industry has given you the Champions of Pickleball Award. 

I got to know firstly, how do we get you into the top 50? Who can possibly be beating you in Washington? Jeez!

Edward:  Well, Washington is a notoriously innovative, high-tech state, and a lot of the companies on the list above us are really amazing companies. There are about 30,000 private companies in the state, so for us to be in the top 100 is really an honor. And it’s a testament to how the amazing team at Pickleball Central has kept the company vibrant and growing. But it’s also a testament to Pickleball’s incredible growth over the last 14 years.

Morgan:  Yeah! I mean for me, the Champions of Pickleball Award that’s most interesting. You’ve invested a lot of time, effort and money into growing the game, and we all thank you for that. I remember running lots of Pickleball tournaments during 2015, ’16, ’17, and every time I call on you guys to chip in for a sponsorship, you never said no, so much appreciated.

Edward:  We think about the sport, like I said, in three ways; the game, the sport, the industry. The game is what we all fall in love with, and that’s what we want to support. There’s more people playing Pickleball because fitness is vitally important to us, especially in the older brackets. I’m now in my late ’50s, and it’s been a real extension to my own athleticism over my life getting involved in Pickleball, but that personal journey is repeated hundreds and thousands of times around this country. And so investing in the game and helping this incredible fitness activity grow and catch fire is part of what we do.

We distinguish between the game and growing the sport, is the sport is the competitive side. What goes on for those of us brave enough or dumb enough to want to go out and play active tournament worlds, or tournament experiences in 10, 7, 8 hours, sometimes battling our way through a bracket to see if we can get on a podium. That competitive world is a whole different circle of experiences and needs for our industry.

And then, the third view that we look at is how we can help grow the industry. And the industry is what supports the game and supports the sport. And we think that a vibrant industry investing in the game and investing in the sport is good for all us and our fitness.

Morgan:  Certainly. So obviously, Pickleball Central has a real kind of bird’s eye view of the game and the sport. It’s a very much social activity, it’s one of the reasons why we all love it. And during this unprecedented times, the pandemic has kind of forced a lot of people who are social to be – it’s asked everybody to be less social. And you would think that would lead to a bit of a decline in the sport’s attendance. But I have a funny feeling that’s not quite the case. Can you give us a bit of a snapshot of where you saw the game pre-virus, and now that we’re kind of seven or eight months on?

Edward:  So we had been tracking the growth of Pickleball in two ways. One is the participation levels, and how the players are active in the game. The Sports Fitness Industry Association has an annual survey of participation on a very large number of sports, and they have been recording this very consistent, almost 10% annual growth rate in Pickleball participation. And so, we hear the top line number of about 3.5 million players in the United States, that’s 3.5 million people who have played Pickleball sometime in the last year. And then, the core group that plays according to the Sports Fitness Industry Association, about 1.2 million people who are playing eight or more times a year. It’s those core or what we sometimes, jokingly at Pickleball Central call the hardcore players, who are making Pickleball their primary fitness regimen. And there is about 500,000 to 600,000 that we believe fit that profile.

Morgan:  Wow!
Edward:  That number has been growing steadily over the last three years at this sort of 10% growth rate. And that was really our business plan for this year, was based on that core growth model and the number of new participants coming into the sport because of the incredible enthusiasm of the existing players inviting new participants in, was really what we were excited about in January and February of this year, as we were executing the early stages of our 2020 plan. The pandemic threw us a curveball and we did a lot of modeling of different ways we thought the business might go when COVID-19 started spreading around the United States. We had a couple of assumptions; a worst-case that we would see a shrinking of the participation, and the best case out of the gate was maybe it would be just a flat, that we wouldn’t see the growth this year. What shocked us was how many new players joined Pickleball and sought out Pickleball as that socially distant, new fitness activity that replaced other parts of their fitness regimen. Pickleball is that perfect backyard, driveway cul de sac, public park game that if you show up with a net of your own and a paddle and some balls, you’re ready to rock and roll. And it shocked us how many of those entry-level net systems and paddle sets that we sold during the early parts of the pandemic. 

Morgan:  Wow!

Edward:  We believe that about 250,000 new players, above what was forecasted at the beginning of the year, got involved in Pickleball just during the second and third quarter of this year.

Morgan:  Fantastic! So the game is alive and well.

Edward:  At unprecedented levels!

Morgan: That’s amazing!

One and a Half Cents [10:02]

Morgan: We’re going to hold it there just briefly with Edward for one of our new segments call “One and a Half Cents” – because I’m still saving up for two.

Today, I want to talk about customizing your paddle weight to improve your performance. A lot of people have an idea of how heavy they like their paddle. But how many of you know exactly what kind of swing weight or balance point you like? Have you ever picked up a paddle and try to guess how heavy it is and being way off. It’s likely because the balance point plays a role in how heavy it feels, and therefore how it plays. Using lead tape bought from local tennis or golf shops is legal for tournament us and is an easy way to experiment to ultimately find out what weight is right for you and how you like it balanced. As a general rule of thumb, the heavier the paddle, the more power it can create. I use the word can because there is a diminishing return of this principle. And if you overload the paddle to the point that you’re unable to swing the paddle fast enough to generate real force, then those five extra ounces ain’t going to help you much.

If you think of your paddle as a clock where the tip is at 12 o’clock, and the butt of the handle is at 6. Then, 9 and 3 o’clock positions are two of the most common places people add weight. In this location, you’ll feel some added stability and some extra pop.

Moving up the clock will add even more power, and it will raise the sweet spot slightly, which can be useful for players who contact the ball high towards the end. If you find your paddle feels to whippy, then adding some weight around 12 o’clock will give you maximum bang-for-your-buck, but it’s also likely to make the paddle feel quite head-heavy. Adding weight to the handle can work for someone who already has a heavy enough paddle but would like to make it feel a little bit lighter through the air as it will bring the balance point closer to the handle and be effectively making the paddle more head-light.

If you want to keep the balance point feeling the same but would like to increase the weight, then I suggest trying this. Firstly, you’ll need a pair of scissors, a kitchen scale, and someone to remind you not to put your fingers in your mouth after handling the lead tape. 

Thanks, Jen!

Cut a strip of lead that weighs approximately .2 ounces and wrap it symmetrically at the top. It should cover the 10 to 2 o’clock region depending on the width of the tape you bought. Once you’ve done that, add one overgrip to the handle. These are thin and useful and should add around about .2 ounces also. With both the lead tape and the extra grip, you’ve now added .4 ounces to the paddle without really changing the balance point. Toy around with weight and positions until you really find what works for you. Whatever you settle on with weight and balance, I suggest you record that balance point, so that you can get back to it when you get your lovely, new Vanguard paddle. To do this, you can simply stabilize a ruler on a table using a couple of books and move the paddle along it until you find a point that it’s able to balance relatively unassisted. Mark the edge guard there and record the distance from the bottom of the handle to that point. That should give you a good reference to help you get the most out of your new paddles. If you’re out there thinking that adding weight to the paddle is going to give you a chance for an injury, then please don’t. Generally, it’s not the weight of the paddle that causes injury, it’s poor technique, very often, using a forehand grip on a backhand especially backhand volleys repeatedly. So feel free to customize and let me know how you go.

Growth of the Game [13:34]

Morgan:  Alright! Let’s head back over to Edward for more game-changing intel.

So, obviously, you have a unique perspective. What would you say is the biggest driving force behind the growth of the game?

Edward:  I think there is something magical about the fun, social aspect of the game that is lightning in a bottle. And we all know what it feels like to go to a set of courts with our friends and find competition in our level, and get into that social groove for several hours where we drop our paddle in the cue and we jump on the court either as a challenger or we defend, if that’s the kind of setup in that court situation. And the nature of these 15 to 30-minute games that we play, single games to 11 typically in a social setting, is incredibly fun. You get an outcome, you get off the court, you take a drink, you take a breath and you walk right back on the court again. And that kind of mix and rumble that goes on in those social settings are glorious. And Pickleball players, there’s something magical about the sport that attracts these really loving, open-hearted people. And that, I think, has been one really amazing part of the growth, is just the magical dynamic of the game.

The other is thinking about all the volunteers that are out there, both formal volunteers and informal, bringing new people into the sport. USA Pickleball has over 2,000 volunteer ambassadors around the country. That is an army of people teaching in schools, parks, senior centers, even prisons, getting new players involved in this amazing game, and unlocking the athletic potential in so many people who may be thought that their athletic days were behind them.

Morgan:  So, would you say we’ve kind of already reached critical mass, and now the game has it’s own legs. And no matter what is done from here on out, it’s just going to growing like this? Or is it always going to take this army of volunteers and companies such as Pickleball Central to promote, to keep it going?

Edward:  I believe critical mass has been achieved because of the volunteers, because of the people who invest their own time and treasury to sponsor and grow the participation in the game and in the sport, and that creates a sustaining industry. The number of companies that are involved in growing, and a large number of those companies are making large investments in carving out their own niche, and that turns into people on payroll that are earning a living inside of Pickleball, and that creates the commercial momentum to carry us forward. So I don’t see the role of the volunteers doing anything but accelerating and continuing to power our love. But then, it becomes incumbent upon the industry to show their support to all of these volunteers out there and try and help make this wonderful and glorious thing get even larger and embrace more players coming in and finding the joy that we found.

Morgan:   That’s a good point, for sure. Do you think that it needs to be necessarily on traditional TV for Pickleball to really it big time, and reach the kind of audiences that we all know it could get to eventually?

Edward:  I think the term “traditional TV” is a term that is maybe 10 years out of date. The pandemic has shown us that how many of us watched traditional TV during the pandemic? We’re streaming everything. How many different subscriptions does the typical family now have to online streams? It’s a very disruptive time to be in the broadcast television game because citizen broadcasting is this new phenomenon where somebody can show up with literally a phone and that’s it, and they would blogcast it. And there has been this really amazing exciting expansion in self-produced citizen journalist, citizen broadcasting in Pickleball that has exploded the number of eyeballs that are attracted through YouTube and Facebook and other platforms, to the game and to the sport. Now, what we all like to see Pickleball on Saturday afternoon broadcast television? The answer is absolutely — I think it would be an exciting thing. But I think that’s more validation of the growth that we know that’s already there. But the broadcast industries are struggling with the way that they’re attacking sports because the barrier to entry is much lower for citizen broadcasters. So all sorts of really interesting niche new sports are finding their way to eyeballs.

Morgan:  So being on television isn’t necessarily a chicken or an egg, it’s more just going to be an indication that the hard work has already been done by whatever has been really growing the game. And I think you’re absolutely right with this citizen broadcasting, I’m totally going to use that phrase – that’s a great phrase! I do remember going to all the tournaments in 2014, 2015, 2016 and there wasn’t an organized camera really but there was a whole bunch of phones, and the best you could hope for was a handful of shoutouts on Facebook. It seems like we’ve come a long way from that sort of time. 

I always get this feeling like when someone tunes into a television to watch a professional sport, they kind of want to see superhuman things happen. When Rafa Nadal slides around on a clay court for six or eight hours straight, usually eight, there’s no one at home thinking, “I’m pretty sure I can do that.” Can Pickleball one day sort of sell the idea that its best players are superhuman? Or is it going to take an elite player crossing over? 

Edward:  I think that Pickleball can create its own heroes – it already has. There are some phenomenal personalities in Pickleball that are influencing this industry that’s built around 3.5 million players. And it’s just the growth as it continues, will continue to create opportunities for those players to stand on their own. I don’t think there needs to be a crossover. The stars of the sport today are already worthy of that attention, worthy of watching those matches. Who wouldn’t want to tune in on a Saturday afternoon here in Seattle when it’s raining and you can’t get any outdoor Pickleball in, and watch some of our top 10 players in the sport battle it out. It’s just a lot of fun.

Morgan:  It is a lot of fun. It’s a fairly sort of popular opinion that you can take say a Roger Federer or a Rafa Nadal and give them a Pickleball paddle and let them train for a couple of hours, and they could compete or win at Pickleball. Whether that’s right or wrong, that’s kind of an accepted belief by a lot of people. I think it would take a lot longer than that but for me, I feel like, hopefully in my lifetime, we’ll see the flip side of that whereby a top-level Pickleball player can easily transfer over and play professional tennis or professional table tennis or badminton. Do you think that would happen in our lifetime?

Edward:  I don’t know if that transition will occur but I would love to think that it could. The challenge is when you find a sport that people want to play more than Pickleball. I think that’s the fundamental premise that I would have a challenge with, is that these folks would leave Pickleball to go someplace else. But I’m a Pickleball snob, so I have a biased perspective on that.

It is exciting to watch some of the very gifted athletes coming from other sports, and it’s not just tennis. The study that we did back in 2019 suggests that only 35%  of the people entering Pickleball and becoming first-time players in Pickleball have a background in tennis. Sixty-five percent come from other sports. And while the high-end, professional Pickleball world has a higher incidence of tennis, folks like yourself, there are still a lot of incredibly gifted non-tennis background athletes that are in the top 10 men and women players in the sport. It’s really exciting to see someone bringing baseball or golf or some other sporting background and thriving, and using that different style and those different mechanics and intellect.

Morgan:  Yeah, I feel like there is this kind of a loophole in what it takes to become a professional player, a successful player at the top level where there are so many top-level tennis players who have become fantastic professional Pickleball players, they typically all are basically reading the body language of other tennis players as they have done their entire life, and they’re able to kind of get a good read of a shot selection by virtue of their eyes just seeing very similar technique for so many years and years and years. But the problem comes when someone comes over that’s perhaps badminton or just someone with a very unorthodox technique, that great advantage they have in reading that body language and reacting fast because of it is kind of out the window. I remember playing against Brian Ashworth for the first time and not understanding what was going on because my eyes just were – it was so foreign that I think there’s always going to be room for those players up there because they’re going to be the kryptonite for all those tennis players that can’t quite know how to deal with it too quickly. 

Edward:  The Brian Ashworth’s, the Callan Dawson’s, the Corrine Carr’s who come out of these alternate non-tennis backgrounds, it’s fun to watch. Sometimes, when they’re on the court, they may be the only non-tennis player, and sometimes they’re not seeing balls because the opposing team is a little spooked by what’s the player going to do with it? It’s an unpredictable outcome, so it’s a lot of fun to watch.

Morgan:  Yes, it is. I’m sure for your average viewer who sees three top tennis players and a Brian, it’s entertaining to see him get in the better of a lot of us. 

Edward:  (laughs…) Yeah, Brian gets the better of many, many folks. The number of times I’ve been owned by that guy sometimes playing when he’s playing lefthanded. Sometimes even playing a little Selkirk Riley 200P paddle and beating the heck out of me. No tennis is required to accomplish that.

Morgan:  (laughs…) No, for sure. 

Paddle Advice [24:20]

Morgan:  So speaking of paddles, obviously, Pickleball Central sells all kinds of different equipment and balls. Paddles are kind of your bread and butter. How do you test them? I’m sure you get hundreds of questions about what kind of paddle might be right for a certain person. What do you have to go through to test them out so you can accurately advise people?

Edward:  When I got involved with Pickleball Central six years ago, we had at that point in time, about 20 models of paddles. And they were very similar for the most part in construction, a couple of variations that were pretty to logically distinguish. I think we’re carrying right now close to 135 models, maybe even 140 now on Pickleball Central, and the diversity of design, shape, construction is more vibrant today than at any time in the industry, and it can create an overload almost for a new player entering the game or a player looking to upgrade. So we’ve developed sort of the Pickleball Central equivalent of the Best Buy Geek Squad. We have a bunch of really nerdy players who have sought to understand the material science aspect of paddles, the shape dynamic aspect of paddles. The various player profiles, we think about them sort of as avatars that will be different between a badminton player, a table tennis player, a baseball player, a tennis player and what type of paddles might appeal to someone with these various sporting backgrounds. And this Geek Squad is a group of about six or seven tournament players that are all sort in the 3.5 to 5.0 range, and we just take it seriously, and we bring a new paddle in and we evaluate it and we break it down by a number of factors and try and categorize those paddles on our website in a way that a consumer can find a way to the right category page and see a subset of that 130 plus paddles that might be most apt to be right for them.

And then, we give them a 30-day test drive option that if they buy it and they don’t like it, they can send it back and try the next thing. It gives everyone the confidence to take a try at something new. Like the new Maxima, as an example, which is a very neat and exciting paddle that we think is going to generate a lot of attention. But it looks different, therefore, it requires us to be really thoughtful in the way that we describe its play characteristics. 

Morgan:  I love that, generally, people think different is better. And with the Maxima looking different, it clearly is better.

Edward:  I have had a lot of fun testing it. The last couple of weeks, it keeps coming out of the bag. I’ll be out testing another paddle, I keep picking up the Maxima and going back –I’m having a lot of fun.

Morgan:  Brilliant! Well, I’m happy to hear it. And just so you know, I certainly didn’t Paypal you 20 minutes ago for that.

Edward:  (laughs…) Not at all.

Morgan:  (chuckles…) Can the right paddle, essentially, transform someone’s game? Can a paddle really be fit to a person in the same way that golf clubs get fitted to people different kind of sporting equipment can really kind of be customized or fit to a person? Do you have a broad enough kind of definition of what a person would need based on their physical characteristics?

Edward:  Absolutely! And so, the physical characteristics and their athletic background experience combine to create an opportunity for a player to get something. It’s more comfortable and less comfortable for them. So my background is from a racquet sports perspective is racquetball. And racquetball players tend to play the ball a little bit higher up the base. Or for a period of time, racquetball racquets have turned a little bit more tear-dropped and with a focused, tight sweet spot further out, you get higher head speeds because you’re playing the ball further away from your hand, and you can generate more power. And that’s a very different kind of experience for say someone who has a baseball background and used to fielding a ball as an in-fielder for instance, and they play and approach their action with their equipment differently and what their expectation of balance is. And so, I think Selkirk has done a fantastic job of using shape to define characteristics of the paddle that allows almost every player-type to find the paddle that has the right shape for them. Where do they like the sweet spot? Up towards the top? Or down closer towards the handle? Do they want a paddle that’s wider, therefore, more forgiving in rapid kitchen volley scenarios where the players are able to watch the ball all the way into the base? Or does that player have really incredible hand-eye coordination? Or they’re watching the ball onto the paddle each time, and can use the paddle that has a little bit more reach to it and generate more power out it?

So I absolutely think that the technology and evolution of paddle design with the various amazing paddle crafter that is out there has really done a tremendous amount to make players feel more confident. 

Morgan:  That’s very interesting. For someone to be kind of in the category of a square-faced kind of play, is there kind of a broad picture in your mind of who should go towards a more traditional-shaped paddle? Just a square either kind of S2 or Epic from the Selkirk range would be good examples of that more square-faced plays?

Edward:  I think there are players who are – they tend to have less of a high-end tennis background and they tend to have a more general sporting background. They can be incredibly effective and incredibly talented players but there are some differences about the way that say a baseball player or a golfer thinks about hand-eye coordination and how that relationship is there. So the size of the sweet spot being more squared up on those wide-body paddles makes the paddle more playable not just in the length, the distance between your grip and the end of the paddle but also side to side. And personally, if I had to have a paddle that was 12 inches wide and 24 inches long, I love it. I feel like I could probably block better when I face you on the court and not get tagged quite so often. But the USA Pickleball rules being that they are, we’re limited on what we can put out there. So those wider paddles, I think are very forgiving. And then, you compare that to something like the recent trend in paddle design with a longer handle creating more mass out of the end of the paddle, more weight at the point of contact, slightly longer paddles, sweet spot playing further up on the base allows for players to generate more a head speed more a swing way that transfers to the ball, but the sweet spot might shrink a little bit. But for those gifted players with that sort of tennis background, the paddle becomes an incredible weapon.

Morgan:  So, essentially, it sounds like you’re kind of saying that there is a real relationship between a person’s hand-eye coordination, we’ll just call it that, and how long their paddle should be. The further away from your hand the sweet spot is, the more difficult it would be to consistently hit that sweet spot, and therefore, the more coordinated you would want to be to actually make it worthwhile? Is that the roundabout way of what you’re saying? 

Edward:  I think it’s a very eloquent way to say it. You think about like golf, half a degree changing your swing in golf is the difference between you hitting a ball two fairways over than hitting the ball in the middle of the fairway you’re on because of the geometry, the length of that lever that’s got a club head on the end of it. And so that same sort of geometry creates power and allows you to strike a golf ball 200 plus yards. You just scale that geometry down and it becomes more forgiving the wider, the closer the ball is played on your hand.

Morgan:  It’s interesting – I remember I bought a different driver about six months ago or so, and I hadn’t realized the driver I was using was around about a 46-inch shaft which is kind of about standard or so when you buy it off the shelf. What I didn’t know was the vast majority of PGA pros were using 44 or 44.5-inch shafts, so the club is essentially shorted. And, obviously, they are incredibly talented, gifted athletes but they had elected to basically have less power off the tee for the sake of hitting the middle of the clubhead more often. It’s a good awakening for me instead of making me think about the Maxima which had traditionally been 17 inches and is closer to 16.5, how much easier it has become to find that sweet spot more often. And anyone out there, probably just buy five or six just to be sure. Edward said he should anyway.

Edward:  It’s amazing how physics is very similar sport to sport. All of these stick and ball type sports, it’s all a function of all of these different rotational energies that are created through your wrist, your elbow, your shoulder, and how all of that translates into the way you strike a ball whether you’re a baseball player in the batter’s box, a golfer on the fairway, or a Pickleball player on the court. And so, the equipment that you’re using that can change that geometry is really exciting.

One of the things that we’ve always recommended with players in Pickleball is to think about the harder shots to make in the game. Almost anybody can hit a ball out, almost anybody has the ability to hit a ball 40 feet and drive it out. The hard shots are how do you play a soft shot carefully and accurately to make that ball unattackable, that’s generally not a function of power, that’s a function of control. And so, we think that should be the starting point for a lot of your paddle selection if you’re an early player. And then as you advance your skills, you get into thinking about the paddle moving from a shield to a sword; from defense to offense.

Morgan:  So when you’re starting out, make your selections primarily focused on what’s going to help you up at the kitchen more. But as you get better, you can afford to be thinking more about what’s going to give you more of an advantage in the longer shots, the drives, the serves, and trusting that you can make it work for the kitchen as well.

Edward:  That’s fundamentally what we start out advice with new players that are coming in.

Morgan:  That’s worth the price of admission right there. That’s what I should start doing. (chuckles…)

Edward:  (laughs…)

Morgan:  Have you had a chance to play with all the new Vanguard paddles? 

Edward:  I have. I’m really thankful, we have one of the most enjoyable, maybe the best jobs on the planet. At any given time, we might have 10 to 20 paddles that are prototypes, that have been sent to us ahead of time by manufacturers for us to evaluate and start to develop our early content development strategies; how do we describe these paddles to our clientele. And so, when we started getting the advanced versions of the Vanguard, it was really exciting. The Vanguard line incorporates a couple of the latest trends in paddle designs; thicker core combined with that carbon fiber graphite face that creates a wonderful set of play characteristics. And so, for us the fun was we were already sold on the general technology set that Selkirk chose to deploy with those thick core graphite faces of the Vanguard Hybrid. What we were most jacked about was playing with the different shapes and seeing how the different shapes really translated into different kinds of play scenarios. So looking at the paddles designed for Lindsey and Riley, as an example. With those long handles, because both of them are these two-handed, defensive demons on the court that they are so capable of defending their turf with a unique approach. They have paddles that have enough space for them to maintain two-handed contact, forehand and backhand it seems like, so that was fun to play with the new Mark 6’s and compare them to the new Maxima and how good those are compared to some of the shapes that we all know and love out of the Selkirk line. 

Morgan:  And in saying that, can you get a feel based on the wider range of paddles, which kind of paddle is suitable for which player?

Edward:  So there are exceptions to this rule but just at a high-level. Some of the paddles that I instantly start thinking about when I’m talking to a potential customer, that boy who would have started gravitating down this path. And Invikta, for instance, and now the Maxima will probably be the paddle for people who have good racquet sport backgrounds and especially tennis backgrounds. The sweet spot is a little further up though wide enough to be incredibly capable defensive paddles but they can generate an incredible amount of pop by playing the ball up on the sweet spot. And that’s very different than say an Omni designed and shaped by Glen Peterson — I’ve actually met the team there at Selkirk, which is more of a table tennis design, was designed for someone who plays with a finger upon the face. 

And what people may not know is that the Invikta, the Omni, and the Maxima are effectively the same lengths and the same width but with very different shapes of the handle, the neck, and the top. But really, they are designed for three different players with relatively what seems like not a lot of change but really is creating a lot of difference in the playability. So I tend to think about those kinds of players; tennis and table tennis, for those sort of paddle selections. For players coming out of other sports where maybe they don’t have that racquet sports experience, I tend to migrate more towards the Epic. I think that it is the easiest, most playable paddle but you do give up a little bit of length and a little bit of reach. The S2 has the largest surface area, so therefore I see a lot of evolution where people start with an Epic and move up to an S2 when they figure out how to use that additional surface area. So those paddles tend to be in that bucket of players who did not come out of tennis. But a lot of ex-tennis players are using S2’s out there. Don’t get me wrong – there are a lot of folks that will go with that paddle.

Sponsor: CoachME Pickleball

Morgan:  So you’ve seen hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of different paddles in the last few years. What do you think has been the kind of biggest evolution or revolution in the game? Is it shape or materials?

Edward:  It’s both. I think that two or three of the biggest breakthroughs that we’ve seen; one is the increasing adoption of carbon fiber, also known as graphite. The paddles were called graphite paddles originally but the reality is it’s moving increasingly towards a carbon fiber face laid over the core. 

So five or six years ago, we saw cores started to move in the direction of polypropylene cores. Really durable, wonderful, soft feel, great control. We started to see the decline of aluminum and Nomex cores and some of the alternative materials that were being used. So as polypropylene cores became more standard, it then became a function of you do you mate that core with the right face material. A lot of the paddles that were coming out originally were using a half-inch thick polypropylene core. Many started to see some folks experimenting with thicker cores. Selkirk’s example was the AMPED series which was really a breakthrough in product development at Selkirk, and was incredibly successful. And that thick core gave more consistency in the sweet spot, side to side and top to bottom. So you’ve got all the performance that you wanted but just a larger working system and sweet spot. So now, we’re seeing that technology made with that carbon fiber and graphite face material, it’s the best of both worlds. 

But the same exact material cut into entirely different shapes are two radically different paddles, and that’s what’s exciting. You can sort of pick material set and you can pick your shape now, and really get something that’s unique for you.

Morgan:  It’s an exciting time to be alive, isn’t it? Jeez!

Edward:  For a guy who sells Pickleball paddles for a living – yeah, it really is. (laughs…)

Let’s Wrap It Up [41:52]

Morgan:  (chuckles…) It must be really nice to be in a position that yourself and Pickleball Central are in, in that when you invest into something as big as an entire sport and you have the luxury of being able to see your ROI in the actual growth of the entire sport. It’s got to be a humbling experience for you?

Edward:  It is! And we feel a debt of gratitude to the game and to the folks that helped bring this about. We’re considered an old company but we’re only 14 years old. There were people going back to the original inventors of the game; the McCallum family and the Bell’s, and all of these folks that were involved in creating this amazing game, and the magic behind it, it’s all built on their shoulders. And all of the amazing folks at USA Pickleball going back over the years that helped spread this game, the Johnny Appleseed’s of Pickleball, taking this thing around the country, and now around the world. It’s humbling, and so we want to make sure that we’re really doing everything we can to reward and bank and support those folks that have created the industry opportunities like us, and Selkirk, and the other manufacturers involved in the marketplace.

Morgan:  That’s excellent! Even though you’ve stood on the shoulders of giants, you’ve become one yourself. Good man!

Tell me, what’s next for you? I want to kind of draw this and wrap a little bow on it. How can people find you? Do you take visitors? Because people, I think, you’re one of those kinds of people that you could just chat with for years. Can people book an appointment just to talk to you?

Edward:  (laughs…) That’s kind of you to suggest that, Morgan. We have an incredible group of Pickleball fanatics that work at Pickleball Central, so all you have to do is go to PickleballCentral.com. Look up our toll-free number and dial it, and you’re going to get an equally passionate Pickleball fanatic like me but I’m not the only one. There are almost 40 of us running around the shop. So you apt to get somebody on the phone who might have a different opinion but it’s based on the same data and information that I have, and we welcome those opportunities to talk.

We’re currently closed to the public during the pandemic for safety reasons. And we hope, at some point, to open our doors back up to the public. I know you’ve been up to visit and we’ve always enjoyed having you in the shop. It’s always a fun day when Morgan’s on. 

Morgan:  And I hope to be there again soon. Edward Hechter, thank you so much for your time, mate! Let’s do this again soon. I want to keep tabs on the whole industry, and you’re the man to do it.

Edward:  Well, thank you! What I’d love to maybe talk about next time is a little bit about our laboratory and maybe give a little bit of a peek behind the curtain of how we execute some of the scientific side of our testing because that’s an emerging part of our promise to our customers, to stay the most insightful source of information about Pickleball equipment in the industry.

Morgan:  Oh, definitely. We’ll certainly do that. I’m going to have to brush up on my big words, do a little bit of cheating, make sure I don’t get stumped by too many syllables. But yes, we will definitely do that.

Edward:  Morgan, thank you for everything that you do. You are just such a joy to have involved in this game, in this sport. You’re an incredible ambassador, not just here but every place that you travel around the world. I just don’t know how anybody can’t end up having you as a playing partner, as a coach, or even as an opponent and not leave the court a happier person for it. That is so much what Pickleball is about and we’re just so appreciative of what you do for us. 

Morgan:  You’re very kind. This is why I can’t have video, mate. You’d see me blushing. (chuckles…)

Edward:  (laughs…)

Morgan:  Edward, thanks again, mate. We’ll be sure to do it again soon. Say hi to the family and the broader family at Pickleball Central for me. Hopefully, we’ll see you on the court soon.

Edward:  Very well. I will certainly pass your regards, Morgan. Stay safe!

Morgan:  You too, mate. Take care!

Edward:  Sure.

Morgan:  Cheers!

[background music plays] 

Sponsor: Selkirk Sport

Morgan:  Well, that was an adventure. Thanks for hanging out with us today, folks! Until next time, I’m Morgan Evans, and this has been More or Less Pickleball.

Pickleball Trivia Quiz [46:27]

Morgan:  So, we meet at last… I hear you think you know this game. You think you know Pickleball, huh? Well, it’s time to put your knowledge to the test. Let’s see how you score on the Pickleball Trivia Quiz with questions featured on the More or Less Pickleball Podcast hosted by myself, Morgan Evans, Selkirk’s very own player, coach, and commentator. Take the Pickleball Quiz today and see how you stack up against your friends. If it turns out you’re much smarter than they are, then I suggest rubbing it in next time you’re on the court.